HelenMcCarthy@ACEN2023


Professor Helen McCarthy is one of the most prolific academics and historians specializing in anime and fandom. One of the coauthors of The Anime Encyclopedia, as well as books on both Hayao Miyazaki and Leiji Matsumoto, Helen came to Anime Central in 2023 to host a bevy of panels on a variety of topics, exploring the legacy of Leiji Matsumoto, the history of underground British anime magazines, the implications of AI on the manga industry, and the history of cosplay from early masquerades to the expression of fandom we recognize today.

Having long followed Professor McCarthy’s work, I was very fortunate to have been able to attend Anime Central and have an opportunity to both observe Professor McCarthy’s panels on AI and Cosplay, and to get to interview her later that day! I chatted with Helen about why she enjoys paneling at Anime Central, thoughts on retiring long-running panels, how her perspective and opinions on Miyazaki has evolved over time, why she’s passionate about writing about both seminal and under-discussed artists from anime history, the challenges in getting both classic manga and scholarly work published, and the impossibilities of publishing a new Anime Encyclopedia as a single book! It was a delight and an honor to speak with Helen for an interview that we hope will be as interesting and informative for you to read as it was for me to conduct!

As a disclaimer, the interview space at ACEN was set up in the Exhibitor’s Hall, and it was quite noisy. As such, Helen’s voice came out a bit muddled in the recording, making deciphering the audio difficult, and making A.I. auto-translate and voice detection tools indecipherable to the point of being unusable, so it took quite some time for me to work through and transcribe it by ear. I believe I’ve recaptured Helen’s responses as accurately as possible, but I just wanted to asterisk that some parts of our conversation have been edited for length, clarity, and emphasis. 

 

Interview with Helen McCarthy, Anime Central 2023:

 

Manga Mavericks: Thank you for taking the time to meet with me here at Anime Central for this interview! This is my first Anime Central, and my first time to get to sit in some of your panels today, which were really great!

Helen: Thank you.

MM: Yeah! So I was wondering, just to start with a quick question, what attracts you to Anime Central as a place to come visit and do your panel coverage?

Helen: Well, there are different kinds of anime cons, but the thing with Anime Central is that it’s really attractive because of its unique central area, and people come to this from all over the midwest and all over the USA. Some people come from other countries, some people come from Canada, and so that attracts one as a con to be at. 

And a good thing about a con like Anime Central is you get to know the scale, there’s that. That gives you the opportunity to speak to a wide range of audiences, And if I might be real, the expenses.

One of the things is that I love Chicago. It’s a gorgeous city, absolutely gorgeous. And the people here, because I’ve been to several Anime Centrals, they’re just utterly lovely. They look after their guests very well, and they give us all the facilities to do the best work that we can do. So, I’m really delighted.

MM: That’s excellent! And, when it came to selecting the panels you wanted to put on in the con, did you really want to focus on some really new topics like the AI panel, but also include some of the panels you’ve done before like the cosplay panel?

Helen: Well, really, when I apply to do a panel, the conventions will ask me what we’re proposing to do, and of course they have the final say. But generally speaking we found that most cons that we’re doing well because we don’t propose things that will be dangerous, inflexible, or silly. A few fine kind of things probably wouldn’t go down at other conventions.

MM: Right.

Helen: But, what I want are things to do that are things that mirror-max, that are very important to me. Like, there’s the tribute to Leiji Matsumoto. Matsumoto-sensei died in February this year, and he was such a significant manga artist, particularly, for American fandom. For the very obvious reason, particularly for American fans, because of Star Blazers. So I really wanted to do that and the convention agreed that was really essential.

And then the others were topics that I sent in that I thought were very interesting and new, and were all presentations that I’d like to get a more accurate feeling for. And for The History of Cosplay, I said this is probably the last time I’m ever going to do this as a presentation, and I hadn’t done it before at this avenue, so I’d wanted to perform it at another convention once more for fun.

MM: Excellent! And I’m very then honored to be able to have seen what might be the last time you present the Cosplay panel. May I ask what is going behind your decision to discontinue it? You also mentioned you’re interested in converting that panel into more of a book so…

Helen: Well, that’s basically it. The full History of Cosplay has been eleven years of my research time, and I decided there’s other things I’d to asses more, and things alike minuscule enough that I’d like to research for panels. But also, now having this material, to consider making a book on the History of Cosplay from my perspective, which is quite different from the perspective of all the other people who write about cosplay. So I think that it’s not really constructive for me to be doing a panel at the time you’re pitching the book to publishers and saying “are you interested in selling this?”… while I’m presenting why and follow to publication. So, I just think it’s a good idea to pull it for a little while.

 

MM: That makes a lot of sense. But you also mentioned – I overheard during the Q&A at the end of the AI in Anime panel – you’re working on a new book on Miyazaki, 25 years after your original book, and I was curious about your thoughts on revisiting Miyazaki and doing a new book on him. What do you want to add to that conversation about him?

Helen: Well, first of all, my original book on Miyazaki just went as far as to Princess Mononoke. I’d which written it just before Princess Mononoke came out, which I saw it the last day that I could’ve seen it. But after Mononoke, his work took a different direction, and so there’s a lot to be said about that work that I haven’t yet covered in book form, that I’ve done all to write and thought about.

The other thing is that I only first saw My Neighbor Totoro once and was in love, and knew that that film would change my life and knew I would have to look through so many of his films, and that’s worked very well. But obviously, I’m a different person than I was when I wrote the book, and so is Miyazaki. His work has changed over time, and my views have changed over time. I’ve gotten to know a little bit better the backgrounds of his work, and the context of his work, and I’m have different thoughts and different ideas, and so I thought to myself what I was going to do, what a new book would have – time to address both the fact that he has continued to work since I wrote my book and the fact that I want to take a different approach. His more mature, older films are absolutely not what he would’ve made if he were to today.

But certainly, he’s a director that continues to adventure. This has made his films more interesting.

MM: Absolutely. I think that is a great idea, to consider his work past Mononoke, and because Miyazaki himself as a creator has most definitely changed and evolved in of himself. But having seen first hand and gotten a chance to speak to him personally for the book – I really love the story on Twitter you shared a little while ago (on April 26th 2023) about doing an interview with him and him taking time to resuscitate a bird that crashed into the window. And that’s just one story, an example of Miyazaki’s kindness. How you wrote about it, that he had just this great grin on his face when he was letting the bird go, that’s a side of Miyazaki that I don’t feel like we really see discussed that often. We see the more curmudgeonly side of him talked about.

So, I’m curious about what are some aspects about Miyazaki the person that you feel that most fans, most people who are into anime, are really unaware of? Like, sides of him people won’t often find within his films?

Helen: Well, there are many aspects of a director and their personal life that fans aren’t aware of, and it’s all right, because there should be some privacy between themselves and their personal life. Fans aren’t to feel they know the director at all. That the people that they’re a fan of are entitled to stand up and be a little bit bothered. But I think then that’s definitely one of the lines Miyazaki’s purposely drawn throughout his film career. The last few times he’s come over(seas), it has been with company.

So if his solution is, if I could make it so, “society are the ones who will remake society,” he’s very socio-conscious. He’s very critical, animated. One can sense that he likes to be provocative in his animation, in the sense that situations look upon us, relate to politics, current affairs, involve killing, and more that he gives. And so, I think we can see Miyazaki’s views on how society should improve, in the way that he wants. And we have no certainness but in wanting to respond to them.

MM: Yeah, I think I can clearly see a lot of that in his work too. I mean especially, many of his films have such a clear anti-war stance and such.

But, to turn back to [Leiji] Matsumoto – I missed your panel on Friday, so I was just curious on your thoughts on what you feel about Matsumoto’s legacy, the legacy he’s left behind. Like obviously, his work was so influential, as you just discussed in the cosplay panel on that scene, on fan communities, on just the spread of anime fandom and culture. I was just wondering what do you feel is going to be his lasting legacy for us?

Helen: Hard to pin it. His lasting legacy is enormous because there we now know much more of his work than we did, and then there’s more of it to go underneath it. But I think another part about his legacy is definitely anime and anime fandom, because without Star Blazers on tv, fandom would not, in my opinion, have taken off as quickly as it did. Once Star Blazers was on tv, then fans started showing it in video rooms at science-fiction conventions, before anime cons existed. And they started first putting it at conventions in the Slavs before anybody there knew about anime save by name. Their fans chose Matsumoto’s work to recruit for anime fandom. And a very similar thing happened in France, and they, France, generally they love anime because it was more widely available as was manga. Albator – Captain Harlock – was a major influence on French fandom. And, in Italy, they very kindly regard it too. So, he’s been someone that shows a core trans-accessible to America and Europe in very direct and very simple ways. So there’s one legacy of directness and communication and jumping through it. And, having made it, that’s the fun.

MM: Yeah, from what I’ve learned about Matsumoto’s influence on anime and manga – like I’ve listened to Zack Davisson talk about it – that absolutely seems so incredible on fandom.

But yeah, do you think there might be a chance for more of a post-humous popularity of his work here in America, or in the places where his work didn’t really become as household a name as, like, Tezuka for example?

Helen: There are two factors that must be present in order for his work to revive. One is Matsumoto, and all of his artists and animators, is that most of their work was really literally a limited animation style, and his camera as well.

And it stayed the same way I believe for most of the anime. If you want to render that anime maximally, you have to have two ways. Most of the animation that was the bedrock of modern anime is not of sufficient quality or of the right style to be acceptable to be mass-marketed as we insist today. So, the issue of worth is, “do we do a reboot?”

Two, is there to a way to create a Matsumoto remake, a new version with, among other things, a more sophisticated form of the animation that will move modern audiences? But I think, to me, it seems that there was very long and long ago thought that to refresh the works you had to work with that author. And it’s possible that they can bump work worth reviving for cels and classic box sets for many of the classic tv series, but that isn’t going to translate into high levels of popular works. That’s only going to be people who go to anime cons, then there’s certainty there.

MM: Yeah, that’s a shame, I would definitely like to see his work more recognized. Thankfully, we got the manga – we have had several manga of his translated here, and I am very appreciative to have that.

But, you’ve profiled Miyazaki and Matsumoto in your books, and I’m wondering is there other authors that you’re really passionate about that there needs to be more of a deep-dive and exploration of?

Helen: There’s so many. So many. The two problems are, to me absurd, most authors are not really known authors in the U.S. And Rumiko Takahashi probably is one. But then only barely because even with Takahashi you would have to say “the person who made Urusei Yatsura, the person who made this or that.” With Clamp, “that’s all the people who made… this or this.” Sailor Moon’s Naoko Takeuichi? She’s probably another known name trifle-ated, even given all her work! Very few people don’t have information or a book. Publishers literally said ok, “we don’t need to put a book on the shelves.” Or take Chieko Hosokawa, just for fun – people won’t know to know who she is.

MM: Even though she and her manga [Crest of the Royal Family] has run for like 60 years.

Helen: Yes! The problem is that people who really know her, not just people who know her from shojo, in the bookshop have just been really limited to all such, and to the best books or horseplay of important, celebrated books. And the truth is, most manga fans make the decision of which books to walk to in the aisle within 20 seconds of walking into the shop. This is why product design is so cruel. And when they quickly get to their aisles within half a minute to 40 seconds, they’ve already decided whether to move to a new aisle or to wrap it up.

But obviously, [bookstores]’re in the business to share in a rapid, moving process, where there’s more work to be published than are publishers designed who can trade sell, followed by the transfer of remaining direct elites. And for everything beyond those two, then that becomes the book that grows in thought for a second, that there needs to be something that engages the book.

So from the publisher’s point of view, it’s very difficult to sell a book or a mangaka who is not known by more, and has no value than just as a nameplate or a title.

MM: There’s a lot, I can definitely see exactly why. Definitely for more obscure authors, like you mentioned Hosokawa, who has no presence over here in the U.S. because their work has not been translated.

Helen: There have been things of a certain age that’ve been a gateway, to have been big enough to have a publisher talk a translated book. There’s translation of all available abilities in England, plus distribution, of that speed. And without that, there’s no one way you’ll get to have a distributor.

The other issue is, basically, artists who’re the artists of rapt reputation but won’t provide images. If there’s not images, you’re attractive as scholarly workers who’ve had some sort of insight published, but will not talk of things that will have much distribution. But if you try and have a system of something to be written in a year, very often the tax return will be shrunk a little bit. So, there are issues there. There are several issues there.

MM:  Yeah, I can imagine there are a lot of production factors. But yeah, I would definitely love to see more profile books, collections like the one on Matsumoto that you published and on other authors, and hopefully those can come together. And I’d also be definitely interested in a new edition of the Anime Encyclopedia, though I also know that would be a big challenge, especially with how much more anime has came out…

Helen: Also, as a single book? That’s not so bad. A single book is the challenge, because then we’ve cut more down than we’d add newer pages into the Anime Encyclopedia. It’ll have to be two books. And for a publisher going to take in the printing and planning is a huge commitment. Stone Bridge Press, they did, and are utterly fabulous and have done so much to promote Japanese animation, Japanese mangaka, and its culture, but they are a small press and they have very limited funds or resources. If we do a book on the scope of what the new anime are and the people who’re doing it, we’d probably need to find someone who would be inclined to sponsorship, or someone who would be inclined to tell a vision, or outweigh the cost tracts with some sort.

But if there’s a way to revive that, and if we’re selected for funding? Our big, big tome took a huge slate of money out of the company, but could’ve absolutely have been four or five books to consider more toward everything. So for those who don’t really understand, and know none of the internal, typical issues that come up – it is very, very difficult to publish a book of that scale.

MM: I have to imagine. There’s so much more work to be done in the academia on anime and manga, and I really appreciate your efforts. Unfortunately, we’re out of time, but I’m really grateful to have this conversation and to talk about it with you today. And, would you want to just let people know where you’ll be next, what to look forward to in terms of your next future work or appearances?

Helen: I do not like to talk too much about my future work until it’s finished. I’m sorry, I’m bad at it, it’s not yet there. But I am working now, as you said, on a book on animators, on a great bunch of panels to come hopefully in the years, and very looking forward to doing conventions I’ve gone to a couple of times. I really enjoy the accommodators that’re over here, so that’s always an issue. If you know I’m at a convention, come and find me, or you may go to a convention to get them to accept me. So I very much hope to be back in America again before too long, and I very much hope to continuously dig deeper into anime, and to grow more old (laughs).

MM: Lovely, wonderful! Thank you, it was such a pleasure, Professor McCarthy, and hopefully we’ll have another chance to talk to you again because there’s so much more to explore. Thank you so, so much.

Helen: I was oh so happy to meet you. And now, I have to run! (laughs).

Thanks so much again to Professor McCarthy for her time, especially doing this interview right before she had to run off from the con to the airport, and to the Anime Central staff for helping to arrange this interview! For more of our coverage of Anime Central 2023, you can read my threads on Helen’s panels on the Disruptive Implications of A.I. on the Manga Industry and The History of Cosplay, and for more coverage of Helen’s panels we weren’t able to cover at ACEN, check out Anime Herald’s report on Helen’s panel on The Punk Energy of Early British Anime Fanzines. You can follow Professor McCarthy on X , and visit Anime Central’s website and follow them on X for news, information, and registration for their next con! 

About The Author Siddharth Gupta

Siddharth Gupta is an illustrator, animator, and writer based in Minnesota. They graduated with a Bachelor's degree in Animation from the School of Visual Arts, and have worked on projects for the University of Minnesota and the Shreya R. Dixit Foundation. An avid animation and comics fan since childhood, they've turned their passion towards being both a creator and a critic. They credit their love for both mediums to Akira Toriyama’s Dragon Ball, which has also defined their artistic and comedic sensibilities. A frequent visitor to their local comic book shop, they are an avid reader and collector, particularly fond of manga. Their favorite comics include The Adventures of Tintin by Herge, Bloom County by Berkeley Breathed, and pretty much anything and everything by Rumiko Takahashi.

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